Seed to Exit
Welcome to Seed to Exit, the ultimate podcast all about startups, scaling, and venture capital. Your host is Riece Keck: Startup veteran and recruitment entrepreneur.
Join us as we dive into the journeys of startup founders and venture capitalists who share their insights, successes, and lessons learned from seed stage to successful exit.
Each episode, we bring you candid conversations with startup founders, executives, and investors. Whether you're looking for inspiration, actionable advice, or a deeper understanding of the startup ecosystem, Seed to Exit offers invaluable knowledge and real-world experiences to help you on your entrepreneurial journey.
Tune in to Seed to Exit and get ready to be inspired, educated, and connected with the exciting and ever-changing world of startups and venture capital.
Seed to Exit
Patrick Monnot, Founder and CEO of Pod | Revolutionizing Sales Strategy | AI-Powered Pipeline Management, Enhancing Sales Effectiveness, and Future of AI in Sales
This episode explores the challenges account executives face in navigating complex sales and how Pod aims to address these issues with AI-powered solutions. Patrick Monnot, CEO of Pod, shares insights on sales effectiveness, the importance of real-time guidance, and the evolving landscape of AI in sales.
• Discussing the distinct challenges faced by AEs
• Highlighting the difference between productivity and effectiveness
• Exploring the value of real-time guidance and insights
• Addressing the market gap for AE-focused solutions
• Measuring ROI through improved sales performance
• The importance of hiring the right talent for growth
• Insights into future trends in AI adoption in sales
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Recruitment: www.mindhire.ai
Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@seedtoexitpod
This is why I think, when you're building in the AI space, you have to understand whether, if you're working in a foundational model, are you just a few months away from having a bigger player launching something better, or do you have a different positioning? In our case, yes, we're an AI enabled solution, we're not a foundational builder. So I think the value in our moat and our differentiation is in the application of these models for very, very specific use cases, delivering very clear and tangible enterprise value for companies. So that's a bit more defensible.
Speaker 2:Welcome to today's episode of Seed to Exit. I'm Rhys Keck and today I'm joined by Patrick Mana, founder and CEO of Pod. Patrick started at McKinsey, later became the director of product and biz ops at Zinnier and is now leading Pod, an AI-powered workspace designed to enhance productivity for B2B sales teams. So today we're going to talk a little bit more about product evolution how do you balance iteration with scalability, product and go-to-market strategy, ai technology, leadership and personal insights, as well as some of Patrick's advice for inspiring entrepreneurs. Really excited for you to listen. Let's go ahead and get started.
Speaker 3:Welcome to Seed to Exit, the podcast where we uncover the stories, strategies and insights that power the startup ecosystem. I'm your host, rhys Keck, founder of MindHire, a talent acquisition firm specializing in helping startups build exceptional teams. Each week, I sit down with founders, investors and industry leaders to explore the journeys behind iconic companies. Firm specializing in helping startups build exceptional teams. Each week, I sit down with founders, investors and industry leaders to explore the journeys behind iconic companies and game-changing ideas. Whether you're building, investing or just curious about what it takes to succeed in the startup world, I want this podcast to be your go-to resource for actionable insights and inspiring conversations. Now, if you enjoy the show, please don't forget to subscribe, leave a review or share it with your network. Your support means the world and really helps bring more incredible conversations to life.
Speaker 1:Patrick thanks for coming on. Very excited to be here. Thank you for having me, absolutely.
Speaker 3:So I'm excited to talk to you. I know we've been connected on LinkedIn for a while. I've seen a lot of your posts jamming out just around different aspects of sales go-to-market product, so really excited to dive into some more of your knowledge with you today. So, before we get into things, tell me a little bit more about Pod, your inspiration for starting the company and some of the traction you've gotten so far.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so at Pod we're a pipeline coaching tool for B2B sales team. So pretty much my whole career I've been at the intersection of product and go-to-market, working directly with account executives. In my last gig so doing the cold calls, the demo calls, the qualification calls I got a chance to work hand-in-hand with AEs and understand a bit of their pain points and ultimately, what I saw as being one of the biggest blockers, biggest thing I saw at the end of the day is a lot of account executive make mistakes managing their pipeline and lose deals because they lack the know how and the guidance to know how to push deals forward Right. They basically have a lot of information scattered all over the place and very limited guidance. They're lucky they get 30 minutes a week with their manager.
Speaker 1:So what we're Pod is pretty simple we're trying to help them to manage their pipeline smarter and we do so by giving them real-time selling guidance, so connecting with all their different data and then helping them to understand what are specifically the deals that they should prioritize and then what are the tactical and tangible next best action they can take to close deals faster, ultimately hitting their quota and getting to the president's club. So, yeah, we're a C-stage startup. So we've raised a little over $3 million US so far. And you know, we've relaunched a new version of Pod a few months back and now we're kind of hitting the market, working with a few hundreds of different account executives across 100 plus different companies to help them be their best selves, so to speak. So that's the gist of it.
Speaker 3:Awesome. So what specific pain points in terms of the sales workflow are you addressing? Because I know you mentioned that you know issues with prioritization, not knowing how to push things forward. Why is that a problem? Is it a training problem? Is it just not having data available to them in the right way?
Speaker 1:There's a few different things. The thing with sales is that it's very convoluted. Right At the end of the day, it's very convoluted, but also very straightforward in terms of the golden metric. The thing that matters at the end of the day is are you closing a deal or not? And I think what we realize is that there's a lot of attention put around productivity in this space, right? So how can I, you know, do some admin work as efficiently as possible? How can I get leads as easily as possible? How do I make sure that I can automate this mundane task or that one? And there's nothing wrong with those. But I think that, at the end of the day, what we truly believe is that it's not because you're getting back five to 10 hours every single week from not having to do as much admin work that you're going to spend five, 10 more hours selling or you're going to do any more better selling. So I think it comes down, at the end, of the difference between efficiency and effectiveness, and although there's a lot of attention on efficiency as a value proposition or as a pain point that companies are solving for account executive, I think that effectiveness is more important, so not increasing the quantity of work being done, but ultimately the quality.
Speaker 1:And I think it comes down to to answer your question to the root cause of what makes sales difficult and where a lot of reps are left to themselves ultimately, at the end of the day and it's navigating complex sales situation. No deals is the same. They all have their different personas, own dynamic, different constraints, different concerns, different questions, different companies, different processes, and a rep, their work is basically to be able to navigate that. And today, although there exists frameworks and methodologies, there's a big difference between the theory and the practice. And I think what we're realizing is that in the moment, so when a rep is in front of their computer about to jump on a call, there's very little real-time enablement, very limited real-time guidance.
Speaker 1:And this is what we're looking to provide reps. It's like giving them that little nudge, that little insight, that little recommendation that'll help them make better, faster and smarter decisions in how they manage their pipeline. And, to be clear, right, we focus on a very specific part of the sales funnel. We don't do prospecting, we don't do forecasting, we're focused on account executives that have, I don't know, 20, 25, 30 deals and are only focused on managing their pipeline, pushing these deals forward. So we're not trying to boil the ocean or solve all the problems for everyone, but this problem of effectiveness is very, very acute for AE, specifically as they manage of pipeline.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I think it's interesting because so many of the sales solutions that I have seen so far are more related to the BDR function, as in prospecting, automation, customization et cetera. I don't do a ton of deep dive on sales AI tools beyond that, but I think that that's really most of what I've seen. So your solution is interesting that it's for AEs.
Speaker 1:There's a lot of, I mean seen. So your solution is interesting, that it's for AEs. There's a lot of I mean. The AI SDR market is very, very busy and very noisy, and I'm not trying to say whether I'm doing something better or worse than what AI SDRs are. I think they complement each other for every organization.
Speaker 1:But if you put yourself into the shoes of a chief revenue officer and think from a money perspective, you know they're putting a lot of money into generating leads, a lot of money right A lead can be.
Speaker 1:You know the cost of acquisition of a customer can be $1,000.
Speaker 1:You put $100 a pop for a lead and then, once those leads are qualified, you basically throw them on the lap of an AE and you expect them to close when in reality it's only the beginning.
Speaker 1:So I think this is why the best organization understand the necessity of building a pipeline and building funnel, but ultimately understand that you need to put a lot of effort in enabling your team to close that funnel right, to close those deals, and putting as much effort and money into that as well. So this is why this is where we see the biggest white space is, at the end of the day, being able to have a percentage improvement in the sales velocity or a percentage improvement in the close rate has a very clear ROI for organization right, it's a clear economic value at the end of the day, because you just have to close one more deal that is worth $100,000 to you know for it to be worth it, so to speak. So it's not about one being better than the other, but ultimately both of them being important to think about your funnel end to end. And I think this is where we come in.
Speaker 3:So when we think about the AEs current workflow because you're right, I think so much of the effort that we talk about, even from a technology and from the sales training, is that BDR to AE pipeline and then you generally think that, like, once you're the AE, you've made it right, unless you want to go into leadership. Since we're on the subject of AI, sdrs, some of the concerns that I have heard are going to be if we automate out the BDRs and we sort of remove the bottom rung of the career ladder, who then becomes the AEs? Is that something you're thinking about or approaching in any way?
Speaker 1:It's actually a very interesting point and I'd love to give you a fancy answer, but it's actually the first time thinking about it that way, Like I've been thinking about being able to use BDRs for not necessarily replacing them, but getting a lot of the mundane research, heavy task automated and then get them to either focus on personalization or contribute in other ways.
Speaker 1:So I never really thought about it in terms of a hundred percent replacement but ultimately augmentation. But I think you have a very good point, though Typically that's the normal path, but I still believe that there's a place in the sales funnel for more junior sales rep, whether it's in what we call today more traditional BDR work cold call, cold email etc. Or something else. I think there's still going to be a place, because even if you say an ai, sdr or bdr, I think what that has highlighted is the fact that people still want a human interaction. Right, they want to talk to someone. There's so much content out there that many buyer and when you think about their journey, they're going to push out the moment at which they're going to want to talk to someone, but at the end of the day, they want to speak to someone and that person is mostly going to be a BDR. Are you going to need as many BDRs as before? Probably not, but I'm never a big proponent of replacing, but rather kind of augmenting. So that's my take.
Speaker 1:but I don't know I mean I don't know if you've seen or seen or heard things differently out there, but would be curious.
Speaker 3:Well, yeah, it was, it was discussed. There was an episode that we did with um. It was the, the guys over at bounty. Ai is the sharp risky. And then Matt, matt Cooley, and their take was going to be that it's probably going to become more of a junior salesperson who really becomes involved in the full cycle early on, as opposed to just doing the research and pipeline bill.
Speaker 1:But it's, it's just an interesting thought experiment we, you know, we won't know until we we find out. Yeah, Till it's too late, right, right.
Speaker 3:So so let's let's talk a little bit more about the journey of Pod so far. So 100% understand the problem at this point. So when did you come to realize this was a problem? What made you decide to found the company, as opposed to doing the last role that you were in?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, it was actually my previous role. I was at a Series C startup and we had, let's speak, it was actually my previous role. I was at a Series C startup and we had, let's speak, we were underperforming from a revenue perspective and I had for a long time wanted to start a business. And I jumped into that problem and you know, working with the executive team, trying to understand what was the underlying problem with our sales process or our ICP or the enablement, and it kind of exposed me to this whole world of B2B enterprise sales and to some extent to me it was an unknown world because I don't think sales behaves the same as any other function. It's quite unique in the type of people that are there. The incentive structure, the processes, the expectation, the type of skillset is very, very unique and I kind of fell in love with the I said that I think the dual nature of the problem I was seeing. It's not just a technology problem but ultimately also a human and behavioral and change management type of problem. So I really love the problem.
Speaker 1:I spent many months trying to fix it or working on fixing it within the organization and then, when I decided it was time for me to go on to something else. I knew I wanted to build something. So when I was thinking about different ideas, this one kind of was something that I had firsthand experience with and that I I had a, I think, a unique insight to be able to tackle it. But you know the the, the journey of a, of a founder, so to speak, is one where you're consistently learning. So I didn't have a a solid of a perspective on what was the value proposition or the product, as as I have right now, when I started.
Speaker 1:When I started, I had an idea, I saw a problem, I thought I had a. You know, I had a solution that could solve it. And then, ultimately, I just spoke to hundreds, if not thousands, of people in the sales space right, aes, bdrs, revops, SalesOps, sales Enablement, management Consultant, system Implementation Providers, name it and that just gave me a very good. It helped me to sharpen my pencil in terms of okay, well, what is the landscape? How are we thinking about something different than what's out there and, ultimately, better. And ultimately, we're pretty excited about where we are right now in terms of not just the problem that we're facing and the fact that we think it's a very important problem. It's not just a surface level good to have problem. We think that can ultimately make a big difference in how sales teams and reps perform. But it's evolved over time. So yeah, but it started back then.
Speaker 3:What were some of the learnings from those hundreds of thousands of conversations that you maybe hadn't thought about before? That helped change the evolution of the product.
Speaker 1:There's many, many, many, many of those, but, um, I think it there's, there's a few of them. I'll pick a few that I think are most shape the our journey. Um, I think one is around what I was mentioning earlier of efficiency versus effectiveness, productivity versus intelligence, so to speak. We initially started with kind of building an application that would be more competitive, with the likes of a scratch pad or a dually or a rattle that are more focused on updating your Salesforce faster, so to speak, and I think what we realized over time so that was very, very focused on productivity right, making your reps more productive and what we realized over time and ultimately that insight came from, started with one discussion with a director of rev ops and it was in middle of 2022 where that person told me was like, hey, you know, we're cutting expenses. Me was like, hey, you know, we're cutting expenses across the organization and I have to cut half a million dollar in tools, and the one, the first one I'm gonna cut is this kind of productivity tool that we've started that a's love, and I was like, oh, wow, okay, why is that the case? Your a's love them. You told them, you told you know, you told them yourself right, what he was. What he said then was I cannot wrap my head around an roi for that tool like I could. It's not because your reps have a, you know, it doesn't, even if it makes their life easier. I don't see an roi for our business as a whole. So we're going to cut that first.
Speaker 1:And I thought that was very enlightening in the relationship, or the perceived value of productivity or, you know, reducing admin work versus the ROI for a sales organization. And that's where we decided to not necessarily pivot but take a slightly different direction of like, rather than focus on productivity, focus on kind of intelligence insights that would ultimately help to close deals faster and more predictably, so to speak. So that was a big, big, big learning around the perceived value of an organization. Right, we're a B2B SaaS company. At the end of the day, we're going to sell to leaders, vps of sales, head of rev ops, et cetera, et cetera. And if these people don't ultimately see the value or the, you know the, the clear value proposition or the value for for the organization, it was going to be, it was going to be tough, right, it was going to be headwinds the whole way. So that was a big one.
Speaker 1:We always thought about productivity and intelligence is coming hand in hand and we started with productivity. In hindsight, we probably should have started with these insights first. That's one. I think. Another one is in terms of our go-to-market At the very beginning we focus on individual reps as an ideal customer profile, going to them, enabling them, getting them on the platform for free, getting them started, kind of PLG-type motion, right Product-like growth bottom up.
Speaker 1:And I think what we realized over time is that this persona, although they have more decision-making power and flexibility to use new tools than other functions, so to speak, they still don't necessarily remain the main decision makers or influencers in a decision. So shifting from a bottom-up motion focused on AEs to a more traditional top-down motion focused on managers not necessarily leadership, but managers, because they have a clear problem awareness, because they have budget, because they have kind of influence or decision-making power, was another big learning for us. And obviously we're still an early stage company. We learn every single day but those were two big aha moment that has shaped our direction, focus, resources and what we're doing today.
Speaker 3:Super interesting. So to dive a little bit deeper onto each of them. So for the first one, when we're talking about ROI or lack thereof when it comes to productivity, how do you think about measuring or explaining ROI of the current product to customers?
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, I think the ultimate metric is the same for everyone. It's quite simple and it's average quota attainment. It's your close rate, so to speak, or are you hitting your quota? That's the golden metric, ultimately, that most sales tech tools aim for, because that's the one metric that the whole sales or revenue organization is aiming for.
Speaker 1:But I think we like to look at kind of leading indicators that lead to quota attainment.
Speaker 1:So, whether that is conversion across the funnel or the overall sales velocity so rather than typically closing a deal in four months, you'll close it in two and a half months those, I think, are indicators of the fact that you are more effectively navigating your deals and you're focusing on deals that will close, rather than spreading yourself thin and working on 20 deals at the same time.
Speaker 1:You kind of focus on high, you're focusing on high priority or high value deals value in the grand way, the grand meaning of it, so to speak. And you're also to us. It's an indicator as well that you are getting guidance and insights to help you navigate these deals that will help you to go from one stage to another quicker. So we'd like to think about, although it's all linked to the same metric these lagging indicators of velocity and conversion across the funnel is, I think, how we can prove our ROI to organization to say, hey, well, before that was your conversion rate across deals from stage one to stage two. Now it's 20% better and I think that ultimately trickles down into more dollars in the pockets of the company.
Speaker 3:Got it. And then for the second thing that you had mentioned, when we were talking about who you were selling into and a little bit of that aha moment of switching from the individual AEs to the managers, how have you thought about the types of organizations that you're selling into, whether it's SMB, mid-market enterprise. And then how did you make that decision?
Speaker 1:Yeah, selling into whether it's SMB, mid-market enterprise. And then how did you make that decision? Yeah, again, in the hundreds of calls and discussions I've had early on, I got a chance to talk to people that are doing transactional sales, account management, large enterprise deals in all types of industries, from people doing postal services to restaurant services to B2B SaaS and I think what we end up realizing is that the problem that we're solving one of not knowing how to navigate your deal is most relevant to selling motions that are longer or more complex than others. So think about it as the average sales cycle being at least three, four weeks, to go up to 12 month, average contract value being slightly, you know, above a certain threshold, so a minimum of five to $10,000 average contract value, the number of stakeholders involved in your buying committee being at least three people, not just one person. So those characteristics ultimately lead to a more complex deal, more complex, nuanced, ambiguous selling motion, and this is where we typically come in and add most value right. Help reps to navigate that ambiguity. Give them data-driven insights and recommendation to help them navigate it. If you're a company that has a one-call close or a very high velocity or transactional sales cycle, effectiveness isn't that big of a deciding factor in your performance. At the end of the day, your ability to execute fast on a process ultimately impacts your performance, right, so we typically have less value.
Speaker 1:So yeah, in summary, where we really really focus is more B2B, enterprise-y selling motion, with large deals, long sales cycle, complex buying committees. But at the end of the day, we're not industry specific. Obviously we're. It's more relevant for some industries than others, but I found it quite interesting to see that, whether you're selling a $2.5 million MRI machine or an ERP right, the selling motion, or at least the approach or the methodology, ends up being pretty much the same right. So it's unique in its own ways and the way that you pitch a product and the value proposition, et cetera, et cetera. But it ends up being a mix of focusing on the right deals, making sure you're talking to the right stakeholders, make sure you're engaging with them and addressing their concerns, and making sure that you ask the right question or cover the right topics according to your methodology. That's what more complex sales ends up boiling down to. So the industry although from a go-to-market perspective we're targeting some of them doesn't really have an impact from a product perspective.
Speaker 3:So here's an interesting question when it comes to hiring. So I've been doing recruiting for a long time. I've hired a lot of salespeople, mostly in the SaaS space, and it has almost always been, in my experience, a non-negotiable for the person to have sold SaaS in the past as opposed to sales from some other industry. But in your experience and all the conversations you've had, you're saying that the sales motion is pretty much the same. What's your take on hiring for sales, I mean, even in your own company?
Speaker 1:Yeah, good question. Well, I think that the company yeah, good question. Well, I think that the, although the, the skillset can be different. What I meant to say? That to believe the, the, the, the methodology or the workflows of a cell, a seller, in its essence don't necessarily vary that much from one industry to another. Then when you look, however, at the skill set of the salesperson, I think there's a big difference whether you're selling into the fintech space or in healthcare versus more traditional B2B enterprise, I think because of an understanding of the industry, an understanding of their pain points, an understanding of the regulations and understanding of their pain points, and understanding of the regulations or constrained, et cetera. I think this is where the experience of an account executive is going to come into play and is going to impact their ability to be comfortable in one industry versus another, knowing the lingo and understanding the, you know the specificities of what's happening in one industry versus another.
Speaker 1:It's interesting that, in most cases, I think that if you sell into B2B SaaS, it might make sense to look for people that have previously sold into B2B SaaS as well, because I think it's a bit different than selling into healthcare, right, but if you're in healthcare or if you're doing insurance right. I don't think you necessarily want someone that's still B2B SaaS to come in because you need to have some sort of institutional or industry knowledge to be able to talk to insurers or hospitals or, you know, government regulators, et cetera. I think that's my take, I think in our case. Yes, looking take, I think in in our, in our case, yes, looking for someone that has sold SaaS in the past is important because this is what we do and we want people that understand or have navigated in the past the adoption and the buying journey of people in buying or purchasing SaaS solutions.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, and I, I I agree with you. I was just wondering if you were being contrarian, but that makes sense. So on that note, just for you know, since we're talking about hiring, how have you approached internal growth and hiring at Pod? What made you decide to do the fundraise? Was that primarily to support hiring efforts or just for other investments into the company? Tell me more about that.
Speaker 1:It was mostly from a hiring perspective. In the first year and a half of the company, we were very, very lean. It was myself a founding engineer and relied a lot on contractors, offshore contractors in India and in Asia overall, and I think that was it was an uphill battle, to some extent right, and when you're a founder, especially a solo founder, you end up having to rely on people, and when you don't have a lot of people to rely on, you put a lot on your own shoulders. So we worked very, very hard to get the first MVP out. We got a bunch of new customers in, we launched the product publicly, got you know that was when was it? It was May 2023, got a lot of interest and support and inbound users and that was all great.
Speaker 1:But we understood that we had put together an MVP, so to speak, or kind of an alpha or a better version of the product. But in order to get to the next level and have a more solid product and in order to have a higher velocity from a product and go-to-market perspective, I needed more help. That's the gist of it. So the first thing that we did after the seed round was hiring. I was in San Francisco, before then decided to move back to Canada Montreal, hired the team mostly in Montreal and, rather than relying on contractors, this is where I wanted some solid, trustworthy folks that were going to come on board and basically be all in on the mission right, and be passionate about what we're doing and not just treat this as another job. So I think the seed round in the month afterwards we're really focused on hiring and bringing and putting together a nucleus of a team that was super, super strong and an experience.
Speaker 1:But the approach to it was one of quite manual, to be honest, right, when it's that, it's basically all on myself reaching out to folks a lot, talking to people, leveraging my network, because I think I really, really believe that the decision you make from a people perspective this early in the company can really shift the directory right.
Speaker 1:You have a negative leader, so to speak, or a negative person that you bring on board in the first five to 10 people. Then it's just a shaky foundation for whoever you're going to bring next, and I think it was a famous entrepreneur that said that you know, uh, b players don't hire b players. Right, they're gonna hire b or c players, but only a player is gonna hire a players. So, yeah, I really put a lot of effort in bringing like very solid, experienced, knowledgeable folks in um kind of in a core group, and right now we're a nine people and and I think that's that's creates a great foundation from a people perspective, from a culture perspective, from a mindset perspective, and ultimately creates a better environment for us to to thrive into. So so, yeah, what?
Speaker 3:what made you decide to move to to montreal from san francisco, especially given the hiring for tech talents?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, so, so, so, interestingly enough, canada, I'm originally from Canada, so there's a part of it which is also which is also personal, and we were we were remote back then and before the seed round and I had to make a decision on do I stay in San Francisco and then hire in San Francisco, or do I move back to Montreal and hire in Montreal? And I think there's a few, there's a few reason beyond on the personal side, why I move back to montreal is uh, I think canada, generally speaking, from a talent pool perspective, uh, is super, super strong. Uh, montreal and toronto, from an ai talent pool, is amongst the, the best hubs in the world. Yeah, in terms of academic talent, the, the I'm probably going to get this wrong, but out of the four founding fathers of deep learning, three of them are in Canada, something like that.
Speaker 1:Oh, I had no idea In Montreal. So it's a hotbed for a lot of like a lot of kind of technology, software talent. It's also from an economic perspective your, your dollars go further just because of the foreign exchange, uh, and sorry, sorry, the exchange rate, uh, in terms of the cost of living, etc. Etc. So for me it was like, hey, I want to go to somewhere. From a personal perspective, I want to feel like it's time for me and my partner to go back to Montreal, and it felt just from the fundraiser that we had like you got to give, put all the chances on your end and you can get more out of your dollars in Montreal than in San Francisco, where the cost of living talent is significantly more expensive.
Speaker 2:So I think that's the gist of it.
Speaker 1:There's part of it which is financial, Part of it is talent, Part of it is personal. Um, but yeah.
Speaker 3:I know that this is it feels like an eternity, and in particularly in early stage startup time, but how do you see both the, the landscape of your market that you're selling into, as well as pod itself, evolving over the next call at one to two years?
Speaker 1:Um, it's interesting years. It's interesting because I think it has evolved significantly in the past one to two years. You could say that sales has probably been one of the busiest segment of the market when it comes to AI solution. There's a lot of noise, like we were saying earlier. There's a lot of noise, like we were saying earlier. There's a lot of widget-y tools. Not all of them are going to raise to be a company that is going to last for long or to be either a venture backable or just a kind of a business that is going to thrive. So it definitely has evolved, I think, over the next one or two years.
Speaker 1:To me, I think the biggest thing is, I think organization are going to get a better handle or a better level of comfort in how they want to integrate AI solution into their stack, and I'm talking purely about, on the technology side of things, a lot of other things that are shaping up how sales evolves overall. But as it pertains to the role of technology, I think many organizations over the past one or two years did not know how to implement it. They were more comfortable not making a decision than making a decision and, three months down the line, either the solution being obsolete or open, ai launching a model, et cetera, and I've talked to many CROs who told me exactly that it's like I do not know what to do. There's just too much noise.
Speaker 2:So I think that's kind of you know, sorry to have to cut you off, but I mean, I thought about myself like if I was to build in the AI space, I would be terrified that, whatever, oh, but I was going to roll out some new feature my startup disappears.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly, I mean. This is why I think, when you're building in the AI space, you have to understand whether, if you're working on a foundational model, are you just a few months away from having a bigger player launching something better, or do you have a different positioning? In our case, yes, we're an AI-enabled solution. We're not a foundational model builder. So I think the value in our moat and our differentiation is in the application of these models for very, very specific use cases, delivering very clear and tangible enterprise value for companies, and so that's a bit more defensible Open AI. I mean, it's tough to say because they're doing a lot of different things, but they're not going to launch an AI solution for account executive or pipeline management. They're not going to do that. What we do, however, is working with them, is to benefit on any advancement that they make in the foundational model building. Right when we started Pod, we were using well, not when we started Pod, but a bit after we're using ChatGPD 3. And then now we're using, you know, chatgpd 01. So we're using the latest model and our use cases are significantly more powerful, nuanced, thoughtful, reliable, precise than they were before. So I think a lot of decision makers in an organization are, I think, are frightened and are looking for support on how to leverage it.
Speaker 1:I'm part of a community called an amazing community called Pavilion for kind of go-to-market executives, and that's a topic that many discuss. It's like, hey, well, how have you done this? How are you using AI to do that? And not just from a pure rational or structural perspective, but from a behavioral perspective. How do I make sure that my reps are using it appropriately? How do I make sure that I'm protecting my data? Make sure that it's not. How do I deal with hallucinations?
Speaker 1:So it's a lot of questions that I think are being ironed out throughout the industry, throughout the technology segment, and I think over the next one or two years, it's going to be clearer and clearer to leaders how they should leverage it, and it's going to be clearer and clearer for them where the value comes from and how to mitigate the risks of adoption. Like any other technology. Right, ai is just a new term, but when you talked about cloud, it was the same exact discussion. So it's an adoption curve like any other technology. So I think that's where we are in the cycle with AI, and this is going to shape the next two years of the adoption of it Makes sense and I'm rooting for you guys.
Speaker 3:I'm very excited to see how the next couple of years pans out for you and just overall. Thank you for coming on the show.
Speaker 1:It's been great. I appreciate it. Thank you for having me Love talking about this stuff.
Speaker 3:Thank you for tuning in to this episode of Seed to Exit. I hope you found today's conversation insightful and valuable. If you enjoyed the episode, please take a moment to subscribe, leave a review and share it with your network. Your support means the world helps us continue to grow and bring more incredible guests onto the show. Now for more content and updates, follow me on LinkedIn or Twitter, or you can check out MindHire, where we help startups build exceptional teams. Thanks again for listening and I'll see you in the next episode of Seed2Exit.
